When President Joe Biden announced on Sunday that he was stepping down from the presidency, a chorus of Democratic Party officials breathed a sigh of relief.
In recent weeks, Democratic bigwigs from Nancy Pelosi to Barack Obama have mounted a pressure campaign to get Biden to step down. In 2022, former Obama adviser and current political pundit David Axelrod was one of the first prominent Democrats to advise Biden. should be withdrawn. But yesterday’s news left him with mixed emotions.
“When I got the news yesterday, I was very, very sad,” Axelrod said Today, explained Monday morning co-host Sean Rameswaram. “I thought he was a tremendous asset to the White House. Always enjoyed being with him, appreciated the points he was making. I think history will be much kinder to him than the voters now for the things he has accomplished.”
Listen to Sean Rameswaram’s full conversation with Axelrod and follow along Today, explained on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, pandora, or wherever you find podcasts. Below is a transcript of their discussion, edited for length and clarity.
Sean Rameswaram
You were part of this mounting call [President Biden] Step aside What do you think was actually in the cards? Do you think the team was capable of what they are going through now?
David Axelrod
I thought it was almost inevitable after the controversy. The nature of the controversy crystallized what was a large and growing problem, doubting his fitness to serve another four years. They were not only magnified, but calculated by debate.
And then you tried to bookend and assassinate Trump. And his preternatural marketing instinct to find the precise spot to take the hero pose. Two things read weakness and strength, which was the essence of Trump’s message that the world was out of control. “Biden is not in command. he is weak Trump is strong. Vote for Trump.” That was their entire campaign.
Now they have a complication because they don’t have Biden. Thus, it changes the nature of the race.
Sean Rameswaram
Many people who had called for Biden to step down are now glad he didn’t endorse Vice President Harris. Your friend and former colleague, former President Barack Obama, still hasn’t. What do you think is going there?
David Axelrod
I don’t think he wanted to dictate for the party what the party should do, but rather to be a force to unite the party as he chose. I think as we sit here this morning, the day after the president announced that Kamala Harris was going to be the nominee of the Democratic Party. I don’t think there’s any real debate about that.
He mobilized support very quickly in a way that should actually inspire some confidence, because this is a political act and he did it. He is very good at it. I think the last of the possible opponents will support him and he will go about the business of picking a vice presidential candidate.
Sean Rameswaram
So you don’t think he’s going to do what the Republicans have done and wait until the DNC announces who’s going on the ticket with him?
David Axelrod
I don’t think he can, because they are committed to a primary vote of delegates to nominate two candidates to accommodate all states filing deadlines for the fall ballot. They are supposed to meet next week to code the tickets. I don’t think they can really hold it off until the conference. I expect that we will know relatively quickly who the vice presidential nominee will be.
Sean Rameswaram
You host a podcast with a Republican strategist named Mike Murphy, who is anti-Trump, but he’s one of the few voices who says it’s happening too fast with Harris. Do you understand his point of view?
David Axelrod
I do, but I think he would be nominated if there was a process or if there wasn’t a process, for various reasons.
One, he has more of a relationship with the conference delegates. The Biden-Harris delegates were selected by the Biden campaign. And so they’re naturally going to gravitate towards him. The composition of those representatives is in his favour. I think he could benefit from more competition to show that he can win. But I get Mike’s perspective.
One of the reasons I spoke so quickly about my concerns about the president moving forward is that if he had made this decision last year, we would have had a Democratic primary. How do you stress test these candidates in the Democratic primaries? Remember, Ron DeSantis was seen as a behemoth in the fall of 2022, and then he had to go through a nominee battle, and he ended up not being the frontrunner either. You get to know people through that process. That said, he has been tested quite a bit. He ran for president. He was the vice president for three and a half years.
No matter what level of politics you are in, there is no training for it. There’s no simulator you can pop into to find out what the pressure of a presidential campaign is like. In many ways, the campaign mimics the relentless pressure that presidents themselves would experience. He feels like he’s swimming in the deep end of the pool, and that’s a big thing to me.
Another thing he has to learn. He is in that room. He has been in those meetings. He knows a lot about what the presidency is all about. This, too, is something that is very difficult to learn, on the fly. So I think he’s got a lot of arguments on his side for that.
Sean Rameswaram
It looks like Republicans really want to come after Biden and now Harris, possibly on immigration, inflation. Does Harris have the same weaknesses as Biden there, if not more?
David Axelrod
Well, they’ll try to portray him as the immigration czar, and I’m sure they’ve got about 100 ads on it. But the truth is, he’s not Joe Biden. He can now chart his own course.
I’m old enough to remember the ’68 campaign when Lyndon Johnson resigned. Eventually, his vice president, Hubert Humphrey, became a presidential candidate, and the heavy burden of Vietnam hung upon him. He lost by one point, but trailed by 20 points when he received the nomination. And if that race had gone another month, another week, I should say he would have won. So, you know, he has to chart his own course. Talk about what he would do. I think there are points of weakness for Trump on this immigration issue.
Sean Rameswaram
Are you looking forward to that debate?
David Axelrod
yes You know, the funny thing is that the old guy added to the platform isn’t going to be Joe Biden this time.
Sean Rameswaram
Kamala Harris is a Historical Vice President. Obviously he would be a more historic president. Do you think he leans into it, or do you think he leans into problems? He’s leaning into Donald Trump’s various crime wars, what have you.
David Axelrod
Listen, when Barack Obama was running for president, we never talked about the historic nature of his candidacy because we thought it was obvious. Others may talk about it, but he always said, I’m proud of the black community, but I’m not limited to it, and I’m not running to be the first black president or black president. I’m running for president of the United States. Who comes forward and says, you can’t bypass her because she’s the first black female vice president? They were slowing him down.
The case they should have made and should make today is why he is the best candidate, why he has the best chance to win, what he brings to this race. I know there is a lot of enthusiasm among some people about the historic nature of the race. But there are many voters for whom other things are more important. And they want to know, will we get someone who understands our life and is fighting for us? The more focused he is, the more likely he is to succeed, I think.
Sean Rameswaram
You started by saying yesterday’s news saddened you, but you obviously helped turn hope into a political trick in 2008. Are you feeling optimistic right now?
David Axelrod
I do, because I think that what was not yesterday is a race today. I can see the excitement the Vice President has created in the first 24 hours. He raised $46 million in hours, online and in small donations. It’s a record. It is a measure of stimulation which is missing. So I am encouraged by what I see. Hope is better than despair. And this morning, Democrats have a lot of hope that they didn’t have yesterday morning.
